Is it the clutch or something else?

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Is it the clutch or something else?

Postby Andrew » Sun Dec 09, 2018 7:18 pm

Oh dear,

Had a potter around the woods, all good- low ratio work, then high ratio home. I smelt something nasty and assumed it was mud burning off. That went but when climbing the hill home, I started to loose power. I 'm thinking it's the clutch pates but there was no problem changing gear and there were no nasty noises. Before I get the spanners out, could it be that there is something more sinister- like an oil leak maybe that is lubricating the plates?

All the best,

Andrew.
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Re: Is it the clutch or something else?

Postby FrogPart » Sun Dec 09, 2018 10:35 pm

In my experience(s) - I would investigate the transmission brake first , are the shoes clearing when released - did you fully release the lever ??

The worst experience I have had of this :lol: was the early S2A type straight lever (upswept type when seat-belts fitted). I find the release button (chromed) on the early straight lever can come loose quite easily ,first time , eventually I could not move & I found the button on the floor :shock: , vibrations ? you will certainly smell Ferodo then :lol:

btw. The shoe adjuster - expander thingie , secured with 2 hex. nuts and a tab locker plate - you can find the nuts loose and the plate floating around - so check this on the back-plate.
And I thought it was a thermostat !
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Re: Is it the clutch or something else?

Postby Andrew » Sun Dec 09, 2018 11:30 pm

The lever was not quite at the bottom for a while, the loss of go was some time after I spotted that though and the smell had gone. I will have a squint at the brake as you suggest- another new experience for me.

Cheers,

Andrew.
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Re: Is it the clutch or something else?

Postby FrogPart » Mon Dec 10, 2018 12:15 am

One thing you can do at the pre-stage , from cold - go for a run of 2 to 3 miles and keep pulling in at lay-by , feel the transmission drum. Keep making certain the lever is fully off, I would say just warm is acceptable , but if hot - there is a problem , in any case - it would do no harm to remove the bellcrank lever assembly from the chassis bracket , check all present against the parts book diagram. Lubricate the pin/bush , moving parts - clevis pins etc. & they are not worn. Lever ratchet not worn & fully functional. I last purchased some new 'genuine' clevis / pins abt. Y2K and they were £ expensive. I understand the aftermarket ones are just as good (and £ realistic cheap) but have a BZP type finish, whereas genuine are a passivated finish. These parts can rust up :shock:

btw - that expander locker plate has caught me out twice , seemed tight - but not.

ALSO. most important - check the handbrake lever "tension-spring" , if present has not snapped - it secures to a small plate loop secured at gearbox . I have had a bad run on genuine ones snapping - next time I buy a few I will try non-gen. As apparently - rumour is that the main box synchro 'leaf-springs' sold by BRITPART are better than gen. parts - well they would not need to be a vast improvement on material grade to be better :lol:
And I thought it was a thermostat !
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Re: Is it the clutch or something else?

Postby Andrew » Fri Dec 14, 2018 5:42 pm

Just went for a short run-after a few minutes I tried freewheeling down hill for a bit and everything seemed to be free but when I came back up the hill, it didn't seem to be quite right speed wise ( but it was better than the other day which was a longer drive). Then I came in and read your latest post- perfect!- So, back out to cop a fee- the drum is hot- I wouldn't like to leave my hand on it so there is definitely an issue and I will get inside for a look. Is it worth changing the shoes while I am at it?

Cheers,

Andrew.
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Re: Is it the clutch or something else?

Postby FrogPart » Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:21 pm

Normal 4x4 + wheel blocking safety precautions (not forgetting if you have fwh in 4x2 :lol: ), I had a 109" roll a bit more than expected - I got just too confident :shock: on my flat drive , a open ornamental gate only stopped it by tearing a slit in the rear n/s panel :) I have another place with a inclined drive I worked on for many years - but now not in 26 years . That was dangerous , I feared for the up & over door so always left it up with two old tyres stood up in front of another Rover parked inside. 2 jacks in situ. with axle-stands + a 6"x6" gate-post sawn into four baulks , in. conj. with a qty. of cast iron lift counterweight frame pack fillers. By time that lot was done it was sunset - I was pleased to depart.

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I would first , transmission brake off and undo the brake drum & pull off on to the propshaft. You will probably find the T box seal has started to leak but not so obvious. The 90 weight oil once on the drum & shoes can get quite tacky - this creates heat and it soon gets hot-box.

The shoes are Mintex MGR27 (you can convert that to a host of other manufacturers). It is a common-stock part with other vehicles so a full axle-set is £ cheap :) That is if you have two Rovers with Trans. brakes.
A genuine brake drum was expensive Y2K and also abt. 1980 - I have had two well worn (direct Ex-MOD auction) - yet others hardly wear at all - I suppose it is down to suggested periodic check. Something I always check on a 'new' vehicle.
And I thought it was a thermostat !
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Re: Is it the clutch or something else?

Postby Andrew » Sun Dec 30, 2018 6:01 pm

Decided to go for one of the disc conversions- It was entertaining getting the drum off- whacking it on the side with a hammer stated to ease it forward and we were in business. Removing the prop shaft was also fun- I found that there was only one position in the prop shafts rotation where it was possible to get a socket on without stuffing up the faces of the nut- I have ordered a special tool for refitting/next removal. I took the opportunity to check the Uj's- rear set is shot so I will take the opportunity to replace both front and rear and then the prop shaft gaiter. The front prop shaft setscrews are imperial, the rear are metric- I'm going to replace them all with new imperial to suit the special tool !
Happy New Year All.
Andrew.
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Re: Is it the clutch or something else?

Postby blueleggy » Fri Jan 04, 2019 3:29 pm

Those prop shaft bolts are fun :D

I have one of the special tools. Depending on the location some of the bolts are much easier with the tool, others are easier with two combination spanners.

I think the nylocs should be red to signify high tensile nuts, rather than blue stainless steel. I don't know if the colours are an industry specification or just a guide (bit like colours of anti-freeze).

Which disc set up are you going for? There are two that I know of - Zeus and Rocky Mountain.

Graham
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300di (non-turbo 300tdi) engine
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Re: Is it the clutch or something else?

Postby FrogPart » Fri Jan 04, 2019 10:19 pm

Take care with the FRONT prop UJ bolts , for a good reason (I forget exactly - a clash I think on full spring deflection) there are two lenghs fo'rd & aft & there is only 1/4" difference. Checking a good book 3/8" UNF 4 qty. are 1.3/8" long & the other 4 qty. are 1.1/8" long.

Several years ago - I spent a while on Gooooogle searches to determine how to tell the steel grade of Nylock nuts , no indents , white , blue seem common. Don't recall observing red ? Came to no good conclusion - I do have some that are orange :) These are genuine Fiat/Lancia parts , as is common with a few makes of cars - suspension have Metric fine threads & they may not be fine pitch as defined in Zeus tables, also I would expect a higher grade steel on such nuts. I also have some that are yellow - Ford , Peugeot/Citroen ?? A bit like S3 16mm wheel studs :lol: a bit of a rarer M16 fine.. So I think red / orange yellow may be a warning indication - but not some sort of BS / Din / ISO standard.. ISTR - I have both mild steel & stainless steel Nylocks - both with a blue nylon insert.

--------

Originally Nylocks were not used , they were metal clench type , similar to Aerotight nut , the clench is a more rectangular shape and they nuts have a greater depth - they have their own proprietry name. Used at Solihull - certainly at --FM-- and probably a few years later too.
And I thought it was a thermostat !
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Re: Is it the clutch or something else?

Postby Andrew » Fri Jan 25, 2019 6:37 pm

Hi Graham, , the disc I fiited was DA5537 - X-Brake Disc Brake Handbrake Conversion Kit for Land Rover Series by Britpart. The instructions were both terribly written and terribly printed and one of the plates was missing the friction material. Anyway, it's been replaced and I have completed the job. There is a rattle at speed (40mph) so I need to adjust that. Coming home up the hill, I still have the drop in speed that I thought was due to the drum brake binding so it must be the clutch! As before, gear changes are fine and tehre is no audible indication of slip- it just loses speed more than it used to going up the hill. Regarding the nuts, I bought new propshaft fittings with my new UJ's- I didnt pay much attention to teh nuts- I think they were all metal

ANDREW
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